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Hello,

I've noticed some errors in the car graphics. The errors are not software or file errors, but graphical. The L/l trams in Frankfurt/Main are wrong. The Zoom1 graphics are correct only for the motor car, but not for the trailer car. The Zoom2 cars are both wrong.
The 3'rd door from both cars is wider. I assume that the graphics for l trailer cars have been confused to the m cars, and Zoom2 for L motor cars mostly copied from that trailers.

Greetings,
Trix

Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Hello,

I've noticed some errors in the car graphics. The errors are not software or file errors, but graphical. The L/l trams in Frankfurt/Main are wrong. The Zoom1 graphics are correct only for the motor car, but not for the trailer car. The Zoom2 cars are both wrong...</tr></td></table>

Thank you for info. I will change the Zoom1 gfx, and I informed the author of the Zoom2.

The reason is a common problem: There are many photos of the motor car's front, but nearly no of rear view, back doors, left side and trailers. In result, often the trailers are made from the motorized or from other "originals".

But, sometimes the cars were rebuilt: Originally built for service with a conductor who's seat was in the rear part beneath a wide entry door. Later rebuilt for running without conductor, and with a small door only that could be controlled by the driver in a more secure way. However, in case of Frankfurt/M cars I don't know these details.

Greetings,
Jan B.

Wrong car graphics for Sofia/Moscow/exUSSR subway cars 81.714 (the 'head' ones). They've got driver's door only on their left side. On their right side they have just a window of a similar size.

Have a look


And quite a problem with Moscow/exUSSR subway cars of 'E*' types. All the types have similar length, but they have different displacement of passenger doors.

First, have a look at a 'E' car:


The 'E' cars differ from their modifications. They've got doubled windows (so they are a little wider, than on 'E*') and no window after the last door.

Then, have a look at a 'Ezh' car:


Their left and right sides are quite similar to 'G' and 'D', which were being used already, and 81.714, which were built later. The constructors had to return to such kind of a car 'body' because the doors of 'E' didn't fit the platform doors of Saint Petersbourg subway stations (as 'Vasileostrovskaya', for example). Any other modifications of 'E' ('Ezh', 'Em', 'Ei', 'Ech', 'Echs', 'Emh' etc.) have this 'body'.

So could you please correct 'E's and make both versions?

Sorry for my bad English

Ilya from Moscow.

Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Wrong car graphics for Sofia/Moscow/exUSSR subway cars 81.714 (the 'head' ones). They've got driver's door only on their left side. On their right side they have just a window of a similar size.</tr></td></table>

Thank you for info. I think that could be corrected.
Some more questions:

In BAHN, the 81-714 is the version without cab, and 81-717 is with cab. Wrong or right?

One of your photos shows a 81-714(or-717) with the newer front and a blue livery with white stripes. Did the cars run in both colors (then we should add the newer version), or is the old livery wrong (then we should repaint the existing ones)? I assume with "Yugo-Sapadnaja" target the photo is from Moscow.

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
And quite a problem with Moscow/exUSSR subway cars of 'E*' types. All the types have similar length, but they have different displacement of passenger doors...</tr></td></table>

Yes, I see. I think that could be added as a new version.

>Sorry for my bad English

No problem, well understandable.

With kind regards,
Jan B.

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">In BAHN, the 81-714 is the version without cab, and 81-717 is with cab. Wrong or right?</tr></td></table>

Absolutely right. Sorry, I've made a small mistake.

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">One of your photos shows a 81-714(or-717) with the newer front and a blue livery with white stripes. Did the cars run in both colors (then we should add the newer version), or is the old livery wrong (then we should repaint the existing ones)? I assume with "Yugo-Sapadnaja" target the photo is from Moscow.</tr></td></table>

- You see, this car is from a train, which was called "70 years jubilee of Moscow Subway. 1935-2005". It was painted into a little different way and you can see many stickers on the cars: "70", "1935-2005" etc.
- In the original version, all the cars (81-717 and 81-714) are of that colour (deep blue - by the way, could you please correct the color in Zoom-1 view?) with one white stripe under the windows.
- The doors may be painted in two different ways: X or V. On the photo you see an "X" variant. The X is often changed to V while repainting the car in depot, because it's quite simple and fast to draw V instead of X.
Here you can see a 'V' variant:



- The fronts of 81-717 have three var's of yellow lights displacement:
First one 2-2-2 (and letter "M" between bottom lights if the car was built in Mitishi (near Moscow), and no letter if the car was built in St.Petersbourg) - see left photo.
Second one 1-4-1 (and letter "M" at the top if Mitishi).



Third one (today no cars with this front in Moscow; letter M if the car was built in Mitishi):


Red lights (lights of train's 'tail') are always in top right and top left corners of the car's front.
________

A little addition about 'E*' - all the cars have similar front and back.
________

By the way, could you please make 81-740 "Rusich" (project name "Skif") for BAHN? Many photos can be easily found here:
http://www.mymetro.ru/cgi-bin/list.pl?lng=ru&a=2&b=1&c=11
____

Ilya from Moscow.
____

P.S. All the photos in my posts in this topic are taken from http://mymetro.ru

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">By the way, could you please make 81-740 "Rusich" (project name "Skif") for BAHN? Many photos can be easily found here:
http://www.mymetro.ru/cgi-bin/list.pl?lng=ru&a=2&b=1&c=11</tr></td></table>You can make them by yourself with the program NFZ Editor: http://bahn.mosfont.ru/exe/nfz.php .

Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
- In the original version, all the cars (81-717 and 81-714) are of that colour (deep blue - by the way, could you please correct the color in Zoom-1 view?) with one white stripe under the windows.
- The doors may be painted in two different ways: X or V. On the photo you see an "X" variant. The X is often changed to V while repainting the car in depot, because it's quite simple and fast to draw V instead of X...</tr></td></table>

Well, that may result in something like this:



...where one version is a joke
________

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
By the way, could you please make 81-740 "Rusich" (project name "Skif") for BAHN? Many photos can be easily found here:
http://www.mymetro.ru/cgi-bin/list.pl?lng=ru&a=2&b=1&c=11
</tr></td></table>

Nice photos. However, I did not find any data about the length of the train or of the single cars. Without this information, it does not make sense to draw it. BTW: All the E/81-xxx cars are a bit too short for historical/technical reasons. For 19.2m original length, a length of 42 pixels would be more exact than 40. But I think it is not a serious problem.

Also, I am not sure about the 81-74x configuration: Train of 6 cars (as on some photos), or train of 3 cars ("light metro") or more flexible as single cars?

Kind regards
Jan B.

Da die C-Züge der BVG irgendwann mal als Vorbild dienten und später selber in Moskau waren, ist der Joke nicht allzu weit hergeholt.

Karsten

81-740 configuration is (all the cars are double, as you see on photos):

Head-Middle-Head for 'light metro' (Butovskaya line) - 3 doubled cars
Head-Middle-Middle-Head for Filiovskaya line - 4 doubled cars;
Head-Middle-Middle-Middle-Head for Arbatsko-Pokrovskaya line - 5 doubled cars.
6 cars cannot be connected to a train, for some technical reasons it won't work properly.

81-740's length - 27290 millimetres for the head car and 26510 millimetres for middle one.

Width and height are usual.

Some more photos on http://metro.molot.ru/t_skif.shtml
__

About joke: BTW we have one train with red cars (75 years to 'Krasnaya Strela' (Moscow-Petersbourg train)). The doors are pinted into '75' instead of usual X or V.


___

One more addition about E*
Middle cars of 'E' and any types of it never built, only head ones.

The cars of 'Em' type are now being modernised on Tagansko-Krasnopresnenskaya line in Moscow. The driver's cab is deleted, and the lights inside the car are changed into modern daylight ones instead of yellow lamps.
____

All the cars on the screenshot are quite good, but nevertheless the colour of 81.714/7 is wrong. The original colour is just as we've got on our forum at the top of the topic (the background colour of where the word 'Autor' is written)

Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
...nevertheless the colour of 81.714/7 is wrong. The original colour is just as we've got on our forum at the top of the topic (the background colour of where the word 'Autor' is written)</tr></td></table>

This bar does not consist of a single color, but of a mix of about 20 different colors. The same is with any car: Depending on the light (color, luminance and direction), the view of color is widely different. For instance, often the roof seems to be more light, although it is painted in the same color as the car.

With kind regards
Jan B.

Dear Jan!

The metro wagons in Budapest are certainly not grey on their upper half.

See this:

Jan, could you please make the beta-release of soviet subway cars downloadable if possible?

Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Dear Jan!

The metro wagons in Budapest are certainly not grey on their upper half.

</tr></td></table>

Well, so I will change them. On some older and small pictures on the ERS, it looks like gray. In BAHN since some years...

Grtx
Jan B.

Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Jan, could you please make the beta-release of soviet subway cars downloadable if possible? </tr></td></table>

These will come with 3.84Beta8.

Grtx
Jan B.

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Hello,

<table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"><tr> <td><span class="genmed">Zitat:</span></td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Dear Jan!

The metro wagons in Budapest are certainly not grey on their upper half.

</tr></td></table>

Well, so I will change them. On some older and small pictures on the ERS, it looks like gray. In BAHN since some years...

Grtx
Jan B.
</tr></td></table>
Yes, I noticed earlier, but I always forgot to tell it to you. [img]icon_redface.gif[/img]
However, thank you for the future correction! Will the next Beta be again released after the "BAHN-Meeting"?